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jph
makeitdouble
Laptop of these specs won't last a day in general, and they'll also be power constrained in most running profile when straight on battery (you'll be out of power in a few hours if using the full extent of the GPU)
Anyone planning to do 3D work in the wild with no power outlet should invest in a (heavy) 100W power bank. Also reliable 100+W chargers will cost an arm and a leg, same docking stations.
It's definitely still on the cutting edge and you won't be managing it like a wimpy Macbook Air.
Edit: I thought this one had a discrete GPU, but looking at the specs it's not and only needs 65W. Power consumption could be fine ?
speed_spread
You can buy GaN chargers of up to 180W nowadays, they weigh half as much as regular power bricks and are fairly affordable if you need them. You don't even need to cover the peak power usage and can go with a smaller charger covering regular usage and let the battery come to help when momentarily drawing more power (this is what I do with my Zephyrus G14 + 65W Voltme).
makeitdouble
I've been looking at charger delivering 130W on a single port (100W won't unlock the full GPU) and they're not that many.
UGreen and Anker's offerings start at 70 bucks and they're not well reviewed. Docking stations start a triple that and Dell seems to be only reputable maker going these lengths.
To complicate things, many chargers will tout 140+ watts, but only split on multiple ports. Single port output will often be capped at 100W.
chx
Yup, the real page to look at is https://www.asus.com/laptops/for-home/zenbook/asus-zenbook-d... the rest is fluff
> Power Supply
> TYPE-C, 65W AC Adapter, Output: 20V DC, 3.25A, 65W
iFire
I've been using https://www.acer.com/ca-en/monitors/spatiallabs/acer-spatial... for developing OpenXR applications on a "holographic" display and existing applications like VRChat and Steam Home.
The price is too expensive, but if more people use it, maybe they'll be able to lower the prices.
Some videos from streamers partnered by Acer.
- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e9D3BPL7POc
- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=acmGEovxgEw
- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3lwo9U9-iLc
We're V-Sekai (pronounced vee-say-kai):
https://github.com/V-Sekai/ - We're a community of open-source social VR enthusiasts.
LegitShady
My laptop lets me connect my $100 external portable monitor to my computer via usb-c. I can't fold it in crazy ways like this but I have an IPS panel and dual monitors and it only cost me $100. And when I don't need to have dual monitors I just put the second one in my bag, or leave it home.
seb1204
Can you please share a link/name of your monitor? I'm curious
htk
This one[1] is more expensive, but it's 4k, 17" and usb-c. I use it daily with my MBP 16" and it matches the PPI pretty well. And I recommend to pair it with this.[2]
[1]https://a.aliexpress.com/_mPKe3Go [2]https://a.aliexpress.com/_mqiWbKy
LegitShady
the brand is Arzopa and they make a bunch of different models, my guess is based on different panels and their prices.
Fluorescence
> However, I saw a lot of graphics lag and chop in the VR scene rotations
Was it a review/pre-release unit? Dave2D's review 4 days ago said he wasn't allowed to benchmark it because they haven't finished optimising the drivers. I wouldn't rush to performance judgements just yet.
valval
I would — frankly nothing exists in the Intel/Nvidia line to compete with M3 in terms of efficiency. This laptop will either not run the necessary software or run out of battery in less than two hours doing it. More than likely both simultaneously.
csdvrx
Efficiency != performance
Some of us care about absolute top performance, and don't care about the battery life
eggy
I have an Asus ROG Zephyrus Duo 16, and I love it. I use it for personal work in graphics, 3D CAD, animation (Blender), and music, and for work. the dual screen (smaller touch panel below) has really changed the way I work. The battery life is a lot better than I thought given I was planning on using it plugged in all the time. I have had this in Saudi with me for 8 months in the last 2 years, heat and all, and all over, for office work, field work, airports, etc. and not a glitch yet. Dedicated graphics card, 32mb of memory, and a great keyboard (I usually use a Kinesis Advantage 2) for a notebook (reminiscent of my Lenovo T430u keyboard from 2012). It took a while to get used to the touchpad to the right, but it works. I find myself trying to do the opposite when I switch notebooks now - touching the right side of center touchpads and vice versa. I am looking for the best MR headset to come out that I can work with some sort of chorded keyboard or other less bulky input device and still see my surroundings without going blind.
ilaksh
I hope there will be a similar dual screen system that comes with leading edge graphics/matrix hardware (such as for LLMs in addition to 3d) and runs Linux.
rahimnathwani
If you already carry a an iPad in your laptop bag, but use Windows or Linux on your laptop, you can use the iPad as an external monitor using:
- a cheap HDMI USB capture device ($5 from Temu)
- a short HDMI cable to connect that to your laptop's HDMI output
- a USB to lightning or USB to type C adapter (depending on your iPad model)
- a free app to display the UVC camera input full screen, e.g. https://apps.apple.com/us/app/genki-studio/id6466343285
This isn't quite as convenient, but it's not much extra weight to throw in your bag.
soared
Potentially a good idea to avoid using Temu - https://apnews.com/article/temu-shein-forced-labor-china-de7...
ARandomerDude
China is a forced labor camp.
mouzogu
apple captures 60% of profits on its devices while the factory that builds them in China captures only 2%.
now you know why foxconn had suicide nets.
viktorlazlo
Hey soared, I saw your post two years ago about "App lovin," and some possible claims of fraud. I'm a tech journalist. Can we chat? viktorlazlo1@proton.me
headsman771
That's true of every online marketplace unless there's no 3rd party sellers.
eloisant
Or just buy a portable monitor (i.e. Asus Zenscreen).
It's bigger (15 inch), cheaper (less than $150), easier to use (just one USB-C cable).
And if we compare it to the Zenbook Duo, when your laptop becomes obsolete you can just buy any new laptop and still use your portable monitor.
hmottestad
I would also go with a portable monitor. Just keep in mind that a lot of them have quite low resolution, low brightness, poor colour accuracy and that some of them still need a power brick (if they require more than 15 watts).
csdvrx
My portable InnoCN 4k OLED disagrees.
fotad
ViewSonic VX1655-4K-OLED, I don't have it yet, but it's not very expensive and should better than those not well-known brand.
mmahemoff
Both have their uses. Travelling with a tablet (in addition to a laptop) gets you a useful standalone device that's more portable than a laptop and better for certain tasks such as reading.
throw83485
I have one, it is too much hustle to setup cable and tripod. I guess it is ok for longer stays (week+)
This laptop is a game changer.
There are some dual displays with integrated hinge. Uperfect delta.
hmottestad
If you're using a mac you can extend your screen wirelessly to the iPad. I found the image gets compressed a bit but it's still plenty usable for showing a browser during web development.
rahimnathwani
Yeah I was talking specifically about Windows and Linux, because I figured that people running MacOS would already know about Sidecar.
Note: you refer to 'mac' (the hardware) but Sidecar is tied to MacOS (software). A Mac running Windows or Linux won't support Sidecar. A non-Mac running MacOS (aka hackintosh) probably will.
If you're running old Mac hardware like a MBP 2015, you can install Ventura (and user Sidecar) using OpenCore Legacy Patcher.
hmottestad
Just assuming that some mac users don't know about Sidecar or Universal Control. And that most windows and linux users don't know that MacOS can take advantage of an iPad fairly seamlessly as an external monitor.
makeitdouble
While we're on it, a Surface pro will only need a bluetooth pairing to work as a second display for the windows laptop.
Bonus points: it can a accept pen/touch and mouse/keyboard inputs as well, which makes it pretty useful.
conqrr
Can this be done on an Android tablet too like Samsung?
staindk
Samsung tablets can act as second screens for windows PCs AFAIK.
For Linux I've had some success with Microsoft's RD Client android app -> remote to Linux PC.
I'm on gnome though, which has some experimental setting which allows you to set remote desktop clients to act as a new display instead of cloning your existing display.
ghusbands
I've got a top of the line Samsung tablet and a recent windows PC. The second screen experience is absolutely terrible in many ways, the worst being inconsistent lag, sometimes measured in seconds. I do not recommend it at all.
bentcorner
I've found it easiest to use something like deskreen. That way you don't need to rely on your tablet supporting hdmi input, you just need a browser.
You'll need a hdmi dummy plug on your PC though.
rahimnathwani
Probably, as long as your tablet supports an external webcam.
You'll need an app to view the camera. Search Google for 'android uvc viewer'.
RockRobotRock
>a cheap HDMI USB capture device ($5 from Temu)
I've tried a couple of these and the quality is pretty shitty. Maybe they've improved since then.
moneywoes
i’ve tried this with an android tablet and the lag is just unbearable have you noticed this? is it because my tablet ( samsung galaxy tab s6 lite) has usb c 2.0?
spartanatreyu
You're not going to be able to send any useful screen contents over a usb 2 cable.
The outdated Display Port 1.0 can send up to 10.8Gbit/s, and the even older USB 2.0 could only send 480Mbit/s.
That'd let a raw 800x600 image per frame come through.
It'd be better just to stream over wifi.
rahimnathwani
I've only tried it on an iPad Pro, and did not notice any lag.
sxp
A similar device is the Lenovo Yoga Book 9i. The next gen model was shown off at CES and is coming out in a few months. That one also has a 180 degree hinge unlike the Asus model which can't be fully flattened. I've seen good reviews about the first gen model and might get the new one if I get a laptop this year.
https://www.lenovo.com/us/en/p/laptops/yoga/yoga-2-in-1-seri...
blagie
Every non-Thinkpad Lenovo I've had, or a relative has had, has the build quality of a cheap toy, and eventually, some part of the plastic case would crack, a hinge would fail, or similar.
I'd absolutely never buy another one ever.
I'm not looking to buy a new laptop for many years, and I hope a Thinkpad version comes out before then. This is very much a design I appreciate. For now, from the photos, I think Asus did it better, though.
Hopefully, by that point, they'll also be 4k displays. My current laptop has 4k, which is very competitive with dual 3k.
asmor
I actually switched from Thinkpads to a Legion 7 2021 and I'd recommend them over Thinkpads. It is by far the best Linux experience on a Laptop I've ever had.
* upgradable RAM
* two NVMe slots
* actually good keyboard (that unfortunately is part of the case, but replacement parts are available)
* the glass touchpad is better than my P14s with the X1C glass touchpad mod.
* the panel and refresh rate is very good and there's no lottery.
I don't know why Lenovo cuts corners on their business laptops, especially in the last two points.
It's heavy, but I don't lug it around too often, and having a 140W (max power spec) 3070 is great.
Just avoid placing them vertically on a stand, I had to replace the thermal assembly eventually.
quickthrower2
I find all laptops suck. (Not tried Apple though) and so gone for the Dell option (knowing it’ll fuck up like any other laptop) and then going hard on the accident damage, extended warranty, home service etc. Well worth it, had em out 4 times in first 4 months :-)
humanlion87
I agree. I have used HP, Dell and Lenovo laptops and all of them suck in terms of build quality. I use a Macbook for work and even though I hate macOS the build quality of the laptop is exceptional. There is obviously a huge price difference in Windows vs Mac laptops. I am willing to fork additional money to the Windows laptop companies if they can guarantee a well built laptop. But looking at their track record it doesn't seem worth it to pay thousands to get a crappy laptop anyway.
zhyder
I like that the Asus one converts faster to dual monitor mode with a built-in kickstand, and the keyboard has a touchpad.
jitl
Yeah the Asus looks more serious about work. The consumer Yoga line at Lenovo always seems an off to me.
drcode
The yogabook is very well made, very apple-like in fit and finish. Rounded-off corners everywhere, very sturdy, great daily driver.
IMHO the Asus looks plasticky and flimsy in the videos I've seen so far, And when used in side-by-side mode it looks extremely asymmetric and goofy.
(Disclosure: The included yogabook keyboard is a bit flimsy, not as nicely designed as the main laptop, not up to the same standards)
cycomanic
Somewhat related, I've been eyeing the thinkbook twist (oled+eink screen)[1], but it's unlikely to run Linux I suspect otherwise I'd be all over it.
[1] https://www.google.com/url?q=https://www.theverge.com/2023/1...
dspillett
I have an earlier DUO model, one with the half-screen between the main and the keyboard. While shopping for a replacement for a laptop that had been dropped a few too many times, manic me bought it as a gimmick and when it arrived I feared it would just be that. I have found it genuinely useful in various ways though: during dev with various small utility tabs on the lower screen, messaging on bottom screen with full-screen video on top, smaller video and/or messaging on bottom with work on top, etc. Handy that you can easily turn it almost off too, to save battery when mobile.
I still carry a 14" external (USB3) monitor for when at a desk. The extra half-screen is still useful in those circumstances, though, just not as much so.
To make Windows11's taskbar less irritating (which it is even more so, if you can imagine that, with an extra screen under your primary) I recommend using something like ExporerPatcher or another shell improver/replacement.
d3vmax
I have the Zyphreus Duo ( https://rog.asus.com/in/laptops/rog-zephyrus/rog-zephyrus-du... ) with the touch screen in between the screen and the keyboard. Its perfect for todo/whatsapp/zoom/file explorer and I have an external screen/keyboard/mouse (so in total 2.5 screens). Perfect desktop replacement and a good gaming laptop. Mobility is limited due to battery life but it suits my needs.
dspillett
Mine is from the much lower-spec (and appropriately cheaper) ZenBook DUO range. The battery life is pretty darn good until I plug in the external screen, and still better than many laptops even then. It isn't often I'm away from a power socket for and needing to work, but when I am, it can be for a fair few hours. Gaming isn't something I find time for these days, so this model is much better value for this use pattern.
d3vmax
Yes, your model makes sense if you dont require gaming. Asus really makes the best devices. I have been theirs's and HTC fan for years. Had Lamborghini laptop from Asus and HTC diamond phone circa 2008-9.
alok-g
Ditto for me all the way till ExplorerPatcher.
I found the side trackpad less ergonomic, so use a separate (vertical) mouse.
vitiral
Just a service announcement: you can get an external monitor that is charged and driven by a single USB-C for about $100 which weighs about a pound. Feels like it would get 90% of what I want out of a setup like this.
jitl
I initially got a $100 one, but ended upgrading to an Asus model with a touch screen and built in battery. It can run everything (video and charging the display) over a single USB-C cable.
I used to travel with it and sometimes a gaming desktop, but these days I use it around the house whenever I need a display & mouse for a server that doesn’t have a dedicated monitor. Just today I did a BIOS update with it.
This is the one I got on Amazon in 2020, there might be better options in 2024:
ASUS ZenScreen Touch Screen 15.6” 1080P Portable USB (MB16AMT) - Full HD (1920 x 1080), IPS, Anti-glare, Built-in Battery, Speakers, Eye Care, USB Type-C, Micro HDMI, Smart Case, 3-Year Warranty https://a.co/d/cJKzQi8
nolongerthere
A regular 15.6” 1080p monitor from a no name brand costs 1/3 the price, crazy that touch adds so much to the price.
Also you should ID affiliate links.
kyriakos
Honest question, if someone genuinely recommends a product, why is an affiliate link a bad thing?
bdavbdav
I suspect the colour accuracy, viewing angles, display tech (probably VA) from a no name make a fair bit of difference too.
AH4oFVbPT4f8
How can you tell it's an affiliate?
jitl
I just pressed “share” in the Amazon app after looking up the order in my history, that’s what it put in my clipboard.
mirsadm
You can buy an OLED touchscreen monitor for $100? People that are happy with Frankenstein setups will always find a cheap way to replicate a product while ignoring all the downsides of a home grown replica.
blep-arsh
More like $250 for a 16" 500 nits 4K OLED with a touch sensor and questionable color accuracy.
vitiral
Sorry, not touch -- but touch isn't something I want on even my laptop
drcode
Agreed, though having two identical panels with similar lighting and zero fiddling or cables has advantages.
vitiral
Those advantages are the remaining 10% I was talking about :)
WillAdams
No stylus support on the external monitor for the most part though.
The only one I'm aware of w/ a decent stylus which is reasonably affordable (the new Wacom One) is not that great in terms of pixel density (don't want to compete w/ their Cintiq line).
mkesper
Xppen has some really good graphic displays.
WillAdams
Are they compatible with Wacom EMR styluses?
My current setup has my devices all using the same pen technology, which is wonderfully convenient --- I can switch from note taking on my Note 10+ or Kindle Scribe to drawing/annotating on my Galaxy Book 3 Pro 360 or the Wacom One attached to my MacBook.
JonChesterfield
Interesting! A brief look down this rabbit hole while wondering about stands shows various things that latch onto the back of a laptop screen and extend a monitor on one or both sides of it.
smcleod
Looks very tied to MS Windows which is more than a little off-putting in 2024.
spenvo
This is the first time in years that I've been interested in a Windows laptop.
This writeup doesn't include price, but others do, like https://www.engadget.com/the-asus-zenbook-duo-is-a-stunning-... . It starts at $1,499.
It's also just 3 pounds, which is 0.5 lbs lighter than the 14" Macbook Pro. I really like this breakdown by TechChap https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qzBxLYTUuK4, Dave2d's video is also good.
The thing also comes with a pen with high sensitivity.
It feels like this is priced as a loss leader for ASUS.
yewenjie
How's the (community provided, of course) Linux support for these niche laptops?
bsurmanski
This would be amazing for Nintendo DS emulation
Havoc
Has anyone had any luck using this form factor practically? Do the ergonomics and practicalities work out?
WillAdams
I've been wanting one since before Lenovo dropped their Yogabook 9i.
I'm hoping this will become a form-factor/product/class of its own.
Currently, I'm using a Samsung Galaxy Book 3 Pro 360 because it was the only computer I could find which:
- had a Wacom EMR stylus
- high resolution and large/expansive screen
- full OS support
(replacing a Samsung Galaxy Book 12, which I really wish Samsung had stuck with)
I need to have a stylus so that I can draw/annotate/write, and I prefer a tablet form-factor (but will accept a convertible/foldable if need be) --- the thing which kills me is the keyboard is completely disabled when the screen is folded back --- it would be nice for the keys along one (or both) edges of the keyboard to be usable as programmable/modified keys for when one is drawing.
Such a device with Wacom EMR will be an insta-buy for me.
It's really nice to be able to go from taking a note on my phone or Kindle Scribe, to drawing/annotating on my Galaxy Book.
Havoc
Thanks for the feedback!
drcode
Love my yogabook 9i, the best coder machine out there, as long as you aren't performance-bound.
It is great to take to coffee shops because you don't look like those crazy people who take monitor stands and stuff to the coffee shop- It just looks 100% normal (even if you use the full bottom screen)
But then at home I have enough screen size to feel like I'm working on a desktop.
For coding, having the vertical break down the middle doesn't matter really, since you almost always want to work on two documents at the same time, anyway.
Also, the device is very well made and sturdy (the external keyboard is a little flimsy unfortunately, but it's replaceable at least and at least looks nice)
Havoc
Thanks for the feedback!
neuromancer2600
I've been on a Asus Zenbook for almost a year now and I must admit that I am extremely happy with it. I would seriously consider this one, if only I would have gotten used to dual screens. Since I am also using a desktop at home with a 32" 4k display I've really appreciated having everything on one screen.
yjftsjthsd-h
For once I find myself grateful for a device probably having bad Linux support; my poor wallet would otherwise be in grave danger.
tedk-42
No such thing as a poor wallet, only a poor person hehe
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I just saw this in the wild, and talked with the user, who programs 3D AR/VR content.
I saw the dual screen in use with the top screen for a VR scene and the bottom screen for code. The user's interactions among the two screens and keyboard were seamless. The screen colors were vibrant and rich, even in bright light.
Based on what I saw, I would definitely try it for typical office use or even for typical website programming.
However, I saw a lot of graphics lag and chop in the VR scene rotations, and the user said the battery didn't last long enough to get through the day, so YMMV if you're considering developing 3D, AR, VR, etc.